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Vt. farms probed for illegal workers



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By GORDON DRITSCHILO Rutland Herald Staff - Published: November 20, 2009

Federal officials have subpoenaed employment records from several Vermont dairy farms as part of a national immigration investigation.

Vermont Agency of Agriculture spokeswoman Kelly Loftus and Dairy Farmers Working Together organizer Amanda St. Pierre both described the event Thursday.

"Starting last night, farmers started getting visits from immigration officials," St. Pierre said. She said the farmers were told they had three to four days to turn over records.

Reports of how many farmers are being subpoenaed varied. Loftus said the agency was only aware of four farms as of Thursday, but that more were expected. St. Pierre said between 86 and 100 Vermont farms were in the federal government's crosshairs.

Sen. Patrick Leahy, D-Vt., issued a statement saying he was disappointed in the timing of the investigation.

"We have a broken system that does not work well for anyone, and especially for dairy farmers and the workers they need to keep their farms running," he said. "This is all the more evidence that we need workable reform of the agriculture visa system, and it can't come soon enough."

Leahy's office said he has directed his staff to monitor the situation with the U.S. Department of Labor and U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement.

St. Pierre said she has heard from subpoenaed farmers around the state, including in Addison, Orleans and Franklin counties.

Loftus said ICE notified Vermont Agriculture Secretary Roger Allbee of the action Thursday morning and expressed surprise that the state did not get more advance notice.

"This is coming at a time when dairy farms are at the most severe crisis they've been at in 40 years," she said. "The level of anxiety and stress is very high."

Loftus said the subpoenas place a burden even on farmers who are doing nothing wrong.

"The added stress of this is unfortunate," she said.

St. Pierre expressed the same sentiment, saying her group would have preferred federal officials hold meetings or training on the issue before resorting to subpoenas.

"When you have someone showing up at your house saying you're subpoenaed instead of getting a letter requesting information — it's not a way of doing business," she said. "As far as Dairy Farmers Working Together is concerned, we've all followed the law. The way they've handled it has thrown people off guard."

Loftus confirmed that the Vermont subpoenas were part of a nationwide effort described on the ICE Web site targeting 1,000 businesses.

A statement dated Thursday says the agency is committed to catching businesses "who believe they can unfairly get ahead by cultivating illegal workplaces."

The agency also said the businesses were chosen because of "investigative leads and intelligence" and because they have a "connection to public safety and national security."

Agents will review the businesses' Form I-9s, according to the statement, which are completed on every person hired in the U.S. The forms require employers to review identity and work eligibility documents to determine that they appear legitimate.

Nancy Sabin of Charlotte, who advocates on behalf of immigrant workers and helps place them at Vermont farms, said dairy farmers are desperate because nobody wants to work on a farm. She said she believes 3,000 illegal immigrants work on Vermont farms.

"Who's going to do the milking?" she asked, adding that farmers have a hard time finding Vermonters who are willing to do the job.

Sabin said she thinks farmers should launch a statewide strike, dumping their milk in protest.

"What do they want the farmer to do?" she asked.

gordon.dritschilo@rutlandherald.com








READER COMMENTS


Vermont's Welfare Restructuring Project was one of the earliest statewide welfare reforms initiated under federal waivers. Implemented in July 1994, WRP includes a work trigger time limit. Most recipients are required to work in wage paying jobs once they have received welfare for 30 months. The state proves subsidized minimum wage community service jobs to recipients who reach the time limit without employment. WRP also includes a set of financial work incentives consisting of support for families who leave welfare for work and changes in welfare rules intended to encourage and reward work.

http://www.mdrc.org/publications/57/execsum.html


~ As far as I know, VT is still implementing this. They are also giving an option of taking college courses instead of welfare, if they take the college option they are completely waiving the 30 month limit. While they are taking classes, they are working, when they finish college, the grant ends, and they have a career.

This is a google link on many time limits.
http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=2 year welfare limit in vermont&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
-- Posted by Melissa B. on Mon, Nov 23, 2009, 3:30 pm EST

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As I figured no proof, just more non substantiated posting.

The welfare to work ended in 2004. Who was President then? Who had majority? Now, five years later, it's getting rehashed. Obama has a hell of a lot on his plate. It was put there when he arrived, he didn't make it happen!

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/22/opinion/22clinton.html
-- Posted by Melissa B. on Mon, Nov 23, 2009, 2:33 pm EST

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Show me where AYK.. link?
-- Posted by Melissa B. on Mon, Nov 23, 2009, 11:35 am EST

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Clinton had a 5yr maximum lifetime .

Obama undid the welfare reform of the nineties in the Stimulus bill and reversed all of Clinton's efforts
-- Posted by Are You Kidding? on Mon, Nov 23, 2009, 7:18 am EST

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Welfare reform gave it a 2 year limit, in the Nineties. Where have you all been?

http://www.mdrc.org/publications/31/overview.html

http://www.mdrc.org/subarea_index_25.html
-- Posted by Melissa B. on Sun, Nov 22, 2009, 11:45 pm EST

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That he would Tam! My bad!
-- Posted by Melissa B. on Sun, Nov 22, 2009, 11:38 pm EST

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Check out this link for profitable labor http://www.mcso.org/ I agree that an able bodied person should be required to take any job available. Welfare should have a 5 year limit over your lifetime, So you can use it as needed but not as a way of life.
-- Posted by Dave Erwin on Sun, Nov 22, 2009, 11:20 pm EST

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EXACTLY, think of all the money saved, then Burlington could have a place to send their psycho's in need of a place to go and "stay out of trouble".... ha

ML
-- Posted by Jeff Perkins on Sun, Nov 22, 2009, 10:29 pm EST

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Melissa,

That comment was horribly offensive. Anyone with any sense would know that Charlie Manson would make a good butcher. Shame on you.
-- Posted by Tam Suleman on Sun, Nov 22, 2009, 5:53 pm EST

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One of the qualifications of being a liberal is to knowingly tell false statements. hhmm...

ha

ML
-- Posted by Jeff Perkins on Sun, Nov 22, 2009, 2:54 pm EST

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One of the qualifications for receiving welfare is having a physical problem, you know "bad back".
-- Posted by Ed Kuban on Sun, Nov 22, 2009, 1:53 pm EST

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I'm a small business owner and I'm getting pretty sick of farmer's whining. This is just one more example of how some farmers think they are "special" and above the laws of economy and even the laws of the land. Don't get me wrong I have huge respect for the farmers that are successful, now days that means being a smart business person. Family farms aren't viable anymore, I'm sorry but that is the hard truth. Just like blacksmithing isn't viable or independent pharmacies or typewriter repair shops. Things change, adjust or get out, that's the choice. Hiring illegal immigrants isn't a viable choice. We need to fix the system, Leahy IS the current system so he's not the answer. We need to change our representatives if we want real change. What's needed is another party that isn't run by the lobbyists and doesn't owe it's existence to big business or big unions. Pretending that there is no problem or complaining when the feds enforce the laws isn't the answer.
-- Posted by Darin on Sun, Nov 22, 2009, 12:23 pm EST

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I'm confused....

I thought... In order to get welfare you have to prove there is no work for you.

If there is work out there. No matter how difficult or "horrible". They should be told to do it or no benefits/welfare.

I'm for helping people that have no options. But if people are out there collecting money because they are just lazy. Then our system doesn't work.

Prison help? Meh... I know a few of you think I'm a huge lefty. But meh.. I say kill lifers. What is the point of the expense of keeping them alive? Even those on death row can sit there for up to 30 years... What's the point? If there is no doubt that you are guilty and are sentenced for life..... (Load the gun.. Pull the trigger.. Sell the healthy body parts to someone in need and move on to the next inline.)

LOL.. See.... I'm truly not a liberal.. :-)


You know what really upsets me...

"This is coming at a time when dairy farms are at the most severe crisis they've been at in 40 years," she said. "The level of anxiety and stress is very high."

"We have a broken system that does not work well for anyone, and especially for dairy farmers and the workers they need to keep their farms running," he said. "This is all the more evidence that we need workable reform of the agriculture visa system, and it can't come soon enough."

"Who's going to do the milking?" she asked, adding that farmers have a hard time finding Vermonters who are willing to do the job.

Sabin said she thinks farmers should launch a statewide strike, dumping their milk in protest.

"What do they want the farmer to do?" she asked.

???????????

So all of our legislators and officials knew this was going on. They may have been even collecting money to keep their mouth shut. My point is... Anxiety and stress is present because they KNOW they have been harboring illegal immigrants.


Simple fix....

Force people on welfare to do the job. If they don't want to. Take them off welfare..

SIMPLE FIX!!!!
-- Posted by CF Reality on Sun, Nov 22, 2009, 9:50 am EST

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Idle workers in Vt will not work on farms. It's too "demanding", which means hard work.One asked where does one find those jobs posted. Unemployment offices around the state the same places where other jobs are posted. Yeah, we'll get jailbirds to do the work and have the ACLU involved in no time. "Unfair treatment of prisoners". I'm not in favor of illegal workers in the U.S. but think about it a minute, what has the employment of legal Mexican workers affected you on a personal level. Really doubt there is anything.
-- Posted by Ed Kuban on Sat, Nov 21, 2009, 8:50 pm EST

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*that was sarcasm*
-- Posted by Melissa B. on Sat, Nov 21, 2009, 7:13 pm EST

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Ya, that's just brilliant. Lets get Charlie Manson to milk some cows man!!!
-- Posted by Melissa B. on Sat, Nov 21, 2009, 7:12 pm EST

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Olde man,

Ever thought about using people we would otherwise sentence to death for hard labor for life? It was sorta tried right after slavery was abolished in the south but it was incredibly flawed as it was applied mostly to minorities and seen as a "legal" form of slavery. But if we took a new look at the idea for only those on death row, or specifically sentenced to "work", I think we could pull it off. Im not talking about whips and chains, but "factories" or some sort of production system. In other words, instead of killing the person, they could use them to fill a "need" in any given market. Thus they would be creating revenue that the government could then use help fund the prison and others. Just a thought (or stance) that I have pondered in the past.

ML
-- Posted by Jeff Perkins on Sat, Nov 21, 2009, 6:02 pm EST

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AYK - Interesting idea about using inmates to do jobs we can't labor for. You may be on to something
-- Posted by Olde Man on Sat, Nov 21, 2009, 12:35 am EST

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So.............don't run a dairy farm. Who cares? It's your choice. Do something else if it's so terrible. No one is making you farm. Don't hire illegal aliens and expect people to support you. We all have to obey the laws. Even the ones we don't agree with.
-- Posted by Olde Man on Sat, Nov 21, 2009, 12:33 am EST

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I have lived on a dairy farm (as a child) and know something of what is required. It is hard, physical work, often dirty and dangerous (farming is one of the most hazardous occupations there is), with long hours and a lot of repetitive chores. You try getting up before dawn, milking 100 cows (or even 25), getting the milk into the tanks and keeping everything clean and sanitary, mucking out the barn (and dealing with the manure!), turning the cows out to pasture, feeding them, bringing them back in and milking them again--and all the while doing the hundreds of other chores that farmers have to do. There is always equipment to fix or keep in repair, buildings to see to, and then let's not forget the crops (which means plowing, fertilizing, planting, cultivation, harvesting, storage, etc.) and the general property maintenance that anyone has to do, PLUS have some kind of family life and maybe contribute to the community in some way, AND try to stay on top of taxes and expenses and so on. I salute our farmers and thank them for doing a hard and often thankless job--without which the rest of us would be up the proverbial creek without a paddle. Oh, yes--and what about veterinary care and the bills that come with it, in order to keep the cows healthy and productive . . . and let's not forget that the farmer also has the usual electric bills and fuel bills and all that, plus taxes, and he or she is probably also trying to see kids through school, maybe college, and all the time hoping that the family farm won't have to be sold and can be kept in the family . . . and add to that all of the government regulations and so on that have to be followed . . . it's a wonder ANYBODY chooses to farm any more.
-- Posted by gina on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 7:20 pm EST

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Perhaps Tom Salmon should milk cows and catch chickens.......
-- Posted by None None on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 6:14 pm EST

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Obviously half of you have NO idea what it is like to be a dairy farmer right now, and you NEED to realize that the dairy farmers cannot find good working help here in Vermont, people don't want to work, they don't what hard labor is anymore they just want a quick buck. I agree welfare needs to get those lazy people that collect for years on end to get out and do some work, however the farmers need people who are going to actually work and do the heavy lifting and get up early to do the milking and working long hours to get the work done. Unless you have worked on a farm yourself you have no idea what it is like for these farmers, yes some of them have illegal immigrants others have LEGAL migrant workers, the ones that have the illegals know they are wrong but hell what are they supposed to do it is the only workers they can find that can help them to get the job done. Until you know how hard it is for the farmers you will not understand. As for Leahy saying the timing is horrible he is absolutely right it is horrible timing the farmers are having a hard enough time as it is with the low milk prices. I wish all you who run their mouths and have no idea what you are talking about would get the facts then maybe you would understand a little more.
-- Posted by MVFD13 on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 4:28 pm EST

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LOL...Mexicans 3000 miles away can find work in Vermont. You'd think a few Vermonters could give it a whirl.

take away teh Vermonters welfare and see jsut how hungry they get, betcha work on a farm wont look so bad afterall
-- Posted by Are You Kidding? on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 2:36 pm EST

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Vermonters don't want to work on farms?? How exactly do you find work at a farm? Check the postings on Craig's list? Look in the want ads in the newspaper?

That's a ridiculous excuse to hire illegal immagrants!
-- Posted by Patrick Burke on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 12:53 pm EST

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All dems want illegals here? Now that's complete an 'udder' bs!
-- Posted by Melissa B. on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 12:17 pm EST

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They are doing this now? The crops are in, that's the usual time that they hire wandering workers, summer, and fall. They go from the south to the north according to crop times. I doubt there's very many left to even look for at this time of the year.
-- Posted by Melissa B. on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 12:16 pm EST

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Leahy like all other dems,want the illegals here.They want them to be able to vote so they can keep getting re-elected.Personally that blowhard Leahy should get out there himseld and start shoveling cow S*** and milking them.Tired of hearing his B.S.
-- Posted by Jeffrey lyons on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 12:12 pm EST

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I support the idea of a guest worker program (we've done it before). I don't know about prisoners; we have a constitutional amendment prohibiting involuntary servitude, so it would have to be voluntary. If I were a farmer I don't know if I would be happy to have prisoners working for me--would they need guards? Would I be responsible if they tried to escape? What if they were violent offenders? Perhaps a solution might be to have a kind of CCC that was aimed specifically at training unemployed young people for farm work.
-- Posted by gina on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 11:00 am EST

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Well, the State of Vermont Dept of Corrections can force people to do their out of jail sentence or community service ont he farms

They have Welfare to Work people that have to volunteer their time in lieu of reach up as well


Americorp- those people can work on farms too. Govt gives those americorp people stipends and living expenses, well they can earn their way this way too
-- Posted by Are You Kidding? on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 9:21 am EST

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Altair Noble-

I responded to this sentence.
"This may not be politically correct and it will probably offend some people but I really don't care. GOD HELP US ALL.

-- Posted by Charles Brisbois on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 6:31 am EST
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-----------------------------------------------------
-- Posted by Are You Kidding? on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 9:18 am EST

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Wow, Mr. Brisbois, get your head out of the clouds. Didn't you read the article? No Vermonter wants those jobs. If "Real Vermonters" wanted to work very long days for very little pay we wouldn't have this problem. However, finding natives willing to do the work (and do it well) is next to impossible for these farmers. From what I've been told these Mexican laborers are for the most part extremely ahrd working and grateful to have the job. Is it illegal to hire them? Of course, but when faced with the prospect of losing their a farm that has been in the family for generations, do you blame them? A temporary guest worker permit for dairy workers is needed. This issue is so complicated that there is no easy fix - milk prices, taxes, the cost of silage, fuel prices - all come into play here and the farmer can control none of it. WCAX did a nice series on this not long ago.

AYK, what the heck are you trying to say - does it even have anything to do with this topic?
-- Posted by Altair Noble on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 8:17 am EST

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It's about time someone started cracking down on illegals. The unemployment rate is historically high yet farmers claim they cannot find any Vermonters to do the work. How about all those getting state and federal subsidies, i.e. Section 8, Food Stamps, etc. work on these farms. I agree with the previous post, have work crew and inmates work on the farms. Create agriculture programs through local high schools and have students do the work. It certainly didn't hurt us to work on our family farms and a good day's work is what some of these people need. Talk about self-esteem -- nothing like a day of working 10-12 hours on the farm to put your life in perspective.
-- Posted by Emile Lacasse on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 8:14 am EST

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Illegal immigrants are illegal. How can you justify legalizing illegals? No matter how ya spin it. The Feds are the only ones doing their job. As I see it. Senator, Leahy, Democrat, VT is not. He wants to do what?????. Again he is not specific.
Bad timing he (Leahy and the Vt. Ag.) say. What does timing have to do with catching crooks and people doing illegal stuff? It's called a sting in legal terms.
There is a lot about this story that disturbs me. Like "without the Mexicans the Vt dairy industry will collapse". Leahy has had 40 years to correct it and hasen't and won't. One answer to help the dairy industry is to have supervised legalized, prisoners do the work. They (prisoners) would be more productive than watching TV and doing nothing all day, like Leahy. They (prisoners) might learn a new skill.
-- Posted by flathead on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 7:53 am EST

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Political correctness is hogwash, its just the libs tactic to shut people up. Its a fantasy virtual thing, there are many people who have no idea what it means, so they jsut say what they mean, and mean what they say!

We still have free speech, something even Obammy can't take away.
-- Posted by Are You Kidding? on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 6:50 am EST

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It's about time that our government starts to crack down on all of the illegals that are working in this country. Senator Leahy should be happy to get rid of all of the illegals so real American Vermonters who are out of a job can now get a job. One way to save more jobs for more Americans would be to require all employers to demand proof of citizenship (make it a law)or the right to work in this country before being allowed to work. Failure to do so should carry a hefty fine to the employer making it more preferable to hire people who belong in this country. America needs to be for Americans first. Unfortunately we (as in our government) are more concerned with what's happening around the world and less concerned about what's happening right here in our own backyard.

I didn't vote for Obama but I was really hoping he was going to make a difference but I guess that won't be happening anytime soon. He's too busy apologizing to the whole world for the actions both past and present of our country.

This may not be politically correct and it will probably offend some people but I really don't care. GOD HELP US ALL.
-- Posted by Charles Brisbois on Fri, Nov 20, 2009, 6:31 am EST

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