TimesArgus.com - We Are Vermont

Douglas says he's strongly opposed



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By Louis Porter Vermont Press Bureau - Published: March 11, 2009

MONTPELIER – A few days after Democratic legislative leaders pledged to make gay marriage a top priority Gov. James Douglas on Tuesday used stronger language than he has in the past to express his opposition to the bill on a variety of fronts.

"I don't support it. I really believe the civil union law we have now is sufficient," Douglas said during a meeting of The Times-Argus editorial board. "I don't see the need to have … a divisive debate about this topic."

With support of lawmakers – including likely a few Republicans – the bill creating gay marriage in Vermont is likely to reach Douglas' desk. Then the governor will have three choices: He could sign the bill, giving it his support; he could let it become law without his signature; or he could veto it.

In 2000, the state was the first in the nation to pass a compromise civil unions measure that provides some of the same rights and protections.

Douglas has made it a policy not to make veto threats and Tuesday he declined to say what he will do if the bill reaches him. But Douglas said lawmakers in every committee should be concentrating on budgetary and economic development issues. If a gay marriage bill reaches his desk before an economic development bill, "I won't be pleased," he said.

Beth Robinson, an attorney with the Vermont Freedom to Marry Taskforce, said if Douglas does not consider the bill a civil rights issue and considers the current law to be adequate perhaps he would consider trading in his marriage for a civil union.

The civil union law was always viewed as a step towards equality – not an achievement of that goal, Robinson said.

"No one ever pretended they provide full and equal rights," she said.

And Gov. Douglas is missing one – if not the central – reason for passing a gay marriage bill: It will have a positive effect on the Vermont economy, Robinson said.

"That is not the reason to do this," she said. "But in tough economic times I don't think we can pass up any opportunity to bring advantages to Vermont businesses."

Just as the state's hospitality businesses saw an economic benefit of the civil union law, the state will also see a benefit from a gay marriage bill becoming law, Robinson said.

"This is not a distraction from our economic situation, it is one factor in a multi-pronged approach," she said. "I think it will be significant."

The state of Massachusetts, for instance, has used its gay marriage statute as a way to attempt to draw workers in technology fields from California, Robinson said.

"The Vermont brand sells and equal rights, progressive social values are part of that brand," she said.

But Douglas said the main work of the Legislature in this year of layoffs and declining state revenues should lie elsewhere.

"I don't believe it is necessary and it is divisive at a time when we should be concentrating on creating jobs," he said.

He has not heard much about the gay marriage bill in his travels through the state recently, either for or against it, Douglas said.

"It doesn't come up a lot, frankly," he said. "It is all about the economy"








READER COMMENTS


I still see no reason for this, no one is stopping anyone from marrying some one of the opposite sex. They are just like us, no differtence, they can give birth, they just can not because of a problem that makes them want to be with someone of their same sex. A leopard can not get rid of their spots, a black person can not change their color but an alcoholic can quit drinking, it is really hard but it can happen. Alcohol addiction does not make a group a minority and does not give them special treatment, quite the opposite. I believe it has been proven that there is a part of the brain that creates a gay person just like the alcolic is created. That would make this a choice and it could possibly be cured by science.
-- Posted by Steven DeForge on Sun, Mar 15, 2009, 7:59 pm EST

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As for a 'manufactured urgency,' attempting to abolish any 'separate but equal' legislation is urgent at all times until the wrong is righted. Last I knew our governmental processes were designed to make affects upon the people's concerns. I fail to see how the civil/human rights of Vermonters does not qualify for consideration within those processes. If we did not have a troubling bigotry laid deep in the minds of some people the entire issue could be laid to rest in moments. It is obvious that our legislators have not simply acquiesced the presentation of this issue because it has been on the table for many years. It is no whim. Time well spent is time spent fighting against bigotry and using every peaceful and/or political means possible to affect the change that is needed. It seems to me however that if bigotry gets its way it will be in a manner of acquiescence in the legal sense, 'such neglect to take legal proceedings for such a long time as to imply the abandonment of a right.'
-- Posted by Ben None on Sun, Mar 15, 2009, 9:28 am EST

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I prefer #3; the manufactured urgency of the issue does not excuse the perversion of our governmental processes by a group of activists, nor any weak willed acquiescence by our representatives. If there is truly an existing civil right being denied then challenge the law and settle it in court.
-- Posted by Patrick Cashman on Sun, Mar 15, 2009, 2:00 am EST

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The concept of marriage is not solely owned by any religion or state. To those who think that marriage was conceived by and is under the proprietorship of their favored belief system I must inform you that the patent for the concept of marriage has expired. To demand that everyone buy into your specific version is out if date. Perhaps those who cannot wrap that idea around their head should question whether they should be living in a country that is based on liberty and freedom. Of course any comments to the negative of this statement will be one of two things...1. 'My religion tells me its wrong so (insert fear and judgment reaction here).', or 2. 'Here is an overreacted scenario explained in a severely simplistic and possibly crude manner to the impact of securing rights for a group of people on my world view.'
-- Posted by Ben None on Sat, Mar 14, 2009, 11:49 pm EST

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yep COUPLES of cousins, brother and sister, uncle and niece, dog & cat, cow and pig, tom and jerry , mutt and jeff....
-- Posted by Are you Kidding? on Sat, Mar 14, 2009, 8:26 pm EST

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It's ridiculous to even have this much conversation and/or whining about this subject. State and Religion should be separate! Gay people have as much right to get "married" like any other couple. If the State chooses to use the word Marriage on their licenses, then that's what gay people should be allowed to receive too!
-- Posted by Shawna O'Neill on Sat, Mar 14, 2009, 6:10 pm EST

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"From the comments here it would seem there are a number of you who are ex governors"

I could say the same for the opposite side.

"No, no more catering."

It's not catering. It's leaving your ignorance at the door and acknowledging that everyone deserves equal rights. You seem to think that we heterosexuals should have the right to make a decision for something that doesn't affect us in the slightest.
-- Posted by Bill Sanders on Sat, Mar 14, 2009, 1:26 pm EST

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From the comments here it would seem there are a number of you who are ex governors, knowing the difficulties public servants face and affording them the same respect it seems you deserve.
The plain truth is this bill smells a lot like a VT cornfield in spring. What group will be next screaming for "civil rights" for their lifesyle? No, no more catering. Vote no Governor Douglas, a veto would be even better.
-- Posted by Mary Larson on Sat, Mar 14, 2009, 7:49 am EST

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418 bills....and THIS is a PRIORITY????
Would proeprty tax reform beon there??? For those of us who have over inflated property values...or maybe adding more Dept of Labor positions to help the unemployed. If more become unemplyed dont you think the state would add positions for them to FIND some kind of work somewhere?
-- Posted by Are you Kidding? on Sat, Mar 14, 2009, 5:43 am EST

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There have been approx 418 bills introduced since 1 1 09.
-- Posted by NEK Native on Fri, Mar 13, 2009, 10:19 pm EST

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Capitan, Hundreds of bills??? please we'll be lucky if they pass 10. As hard as they portray themselves to be working, most of their time is taken up by very few bills. And as easy as it could be to pass this bill it WON'T go that smoothly. And anyone who thinks this will just pass without heated and in depth discussion is dead wrong.
-- Posted by Dave Erwin on Fri, Mar 13, 2009, 1:49 pm EST

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Just because this is the legislation that happens to be getting the most press doesn't mean it's the ONLY legislation our reps are working on. Give them some credit - they're juggling hundreds of bills, most of which will never make the front page.
-- Posted by Captain Obvious on Fri, Mar 13, 2009, 1:01 pm EST

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If the Legislators take two weeks off, it saves the state 500,000 dollars. So basically its 250,000 per week. Do you really think that at a time when the State is laying off workers and more importantly cutting needed services for familys that depend on them, Do we think its the best move financially to allow the legislators the weeks it takes to get this passed. I think we need to hold off on this for another year or two until the economy is back on track.
-- Posted by Alex P Keaton on Fri, Mar 13, 2009, 11:17 am EST

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"And not have something shoved down our throats that we don't believe in."

I'm fairly confident that marriage equality would'nt result in homosexuals getting married on your lawn. It won't affect you.
-- Posted by Bill Sanders on Fri, Mar 13, 2009, 9:44 am EST

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AJ None that's a great idea, take all your homosexuals and move and start an island you could all be happy together. Then the rest of us could go on with our NORMAL lifes. And not have something shoved down our throats that we don't believe in.
-- Posted by BARREHELP on Fri, Mar 13, 2009, 8:59 am EST

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"no more moose muffins right now"

Honestly, I'm not positive why you find your whole "moose muffin" thing witty or amusing at all. All it is successful in doing is ridiculing an entire group of people by equating their struggle to some silly little childrens book. Grow up.
-- Posted by Bill Sanders on Thu, Mar 12, 2009, 8:36 pm EST

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Douglas is an idiot. His campaign platform was Douglas = Jobs. Now the pig can't wait to fire state employees at the same time building his own staff. On top of that he's one of the top paid governors in the country while presiding over a state with 600,000 inhabitants including children. He and the rest of the idiots who hate gay people and oppose gay marriage should find an island and start their own little hate filled theocracy!!
-- Posted by AJ None on Thu, Mar 12, 2009, 6:11 pm EST

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Douglas is a dolt. He won't veto it...he'll let it go thru without his signature, because the economic reality is that Vermont is losing money to Massachusetts and Connecticut, where gay marriage is legal. See, it really IS about the money!
-- Posted by None None on Thu, Mar 12, 2009, 12:25 pm EST

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Typical Republican response, "Let's focus on one issue at a time, to the detriment of any other issues." That is why we are in this position as a nation....we have many issues that need to be addressed and this current administration is not up to task. As another reader penned, "Cheer him now, because he's gone in 2..."

As to others, basic human rights are non-negitiable.......I think I read something about life and liberty somewhere.....in some document...
-- Posted by Eric LeVasseur on Thu, Mar 12, 2009, 11:49 am EST

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Cheer him now, because he's gone in 2...
Just when is a civil rights issue appropriate to debate? What was going on 8 years ago? 4 years ago, or 2 years ago? Using the present economy is an excuse, plain and simple...
With guys like that around, it's a wonder Jim Crow laws got finally stomped outta existence, or women got to vote. (Although with Heidi's around, maybe that should be reconsidered, we could use less female Rush Limbaughs))
-- Posted by patriotemt on Thu, Mar 12, 2009, 10:21 am EST

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Now why hasnt property tax reform come before this issue? Act 60 was done about the same time as civil unions, I dont see changing act 60 every legislative season??? Thank you Gov Douglas, thats why your the leader and the rest of those yellow belly sap suckers are so afraid of a bunch of ingrates that are so self serving, they dont care enough to shut up long enough to let property tax reform and JOBS already here by everyone, not potential income from gays.
-- Posted by Are you Kidding? on Wed, Mar 11, 2009, 10:50 pm EST

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Why is it now, gay-marriage improves the economy and thats why it should be passed? Are you kidding?! Now they move from rights and civil rights taht the union legislations Already provides,,,try another angle, yes lets sell our souls and votes for money? Now that is the entire problem already. gays are no different now than the wall street crooks compromising principles for money.
-- Posted by Are you Kidding? on Wed, Mar 11, 2009, 10:47 pm EST

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Civil Unions DO NOT PROVIDE full and EQUAL RIGHTS. There's your reason Govenor Douglas, to have "a divisive debate about the topic"!

Its real simple, not everyone in this state has equal rights... It's time for a change.
-- Posted by Patrick Burke on Wed, Mar 11, 2009, 5:06 pm EST

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Three more cheers for Governor Douglas!!!
-- Posted by How do I heart thee on Wed, Mar 11, 2009, 1:48 pm EST

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Just what, exactly, would the Governor have the House and Senate Judiciary Committees working on to improve the economy? It's hard to imagine since economic development issues fall well outside the jurisdiction of these Committees. Sadly, the Governor continues to use the harsh reality of these economic times as an excuse to not move forward on the passage of the gay marriage bill, and provides no cogent arguments in opposition to the bill.

It would be refreshing to hear the Governor outline his concerns about this issue in a clear and thoughtful way, rather than continuing to use the economy as an excuse for inaction.
-- Posted by None None on Wed, Mar 11, 2009, 11:07 am EST

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I think Beth is right on the money, trade in the marriage for a civil union. Then try to get marriage rights in another state.
I am so disappointed in the Governor, and I can't conceive of the resistance he's making to this bill. It makes no sense at all, and plays such a small part of the whole legislative process. Changing the law literally will take a paragraph of space.
Plus, it affects him not, but it affects a significant portion of taxpaying voters.
I am watching him and wondering why voted for him. I believed that he's done his share of public service and supported him throughout the years. Perhaps he has finally failed to grow with the job. I hope we don't have a George Wallace on our hands.
-- Posted by patriotemt on Wed, Mar 11, 2009, 11:01 am EST

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Three cheers to Gov Douglas. When it hits your desk VETO IT. Keep what true marriage is all about between a man and a women. Don't fall for it like Former Gov Dean just to buy some votes next time around, he wanted to make a name for himself and that's how he tried to do it. Keep standing up for what you believe in and Vermonter's like myself.
-- Posted by BARREHELP on Wed, Mar 11, 2009, 10:53 am EST

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