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House reps introduce same-sex marriage bill



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By Louis Porter Vermont Press Bureau - Published: February 6, 2009

MONTPELIER – Members of the House of Representatives will introduce a bill today that, if passed, would make marriage for same sex couples state law.

Although the bill is expected to start through the process today, it may be some time before it comes to the floor of the House. In fact, it is not clear if the House bill will move first or a similar measure expected in the Senate will launch the legislative debate.

In addition, activists who support same-sex marriage are scheduled to work on the issue in the Statehouse today.

"It seemed like the right convergence of circumstances," said Rep. Mark Larson, D-Burlington, the lead sponsor of the House bill. "It's time."

The measure has a significant amount of support, with 59 co-sponsors, including Progressive David Zuckerman of Burlington. No Republicans are among the co-sponsors, although the measure is expected to gain the support of at least some of the House's 48 Republicans if it makes its way to the floor.

Likewise, some Democrats, particularly those from more conservative districts, are likely to vote against it.

"I am confident when the bill comes to the floor it will have tri-partisan support, which is what really matters," Larson said.

Republican House Leader Patti Komline of Dorset, for one, said she will support the bill.

"I consider it a civil rights issue," she said.

Activists and supporters among lawmakers have been pushing for the measure for several years. Given the divisiveness and opposition stirred up by the state's civil union measure – passed in 2000, the first law in the country to grant same-sex couples many of the same legal rights as heterosexual married couples – its introduction sparks some worries among legislators.

What is not clear is if opposition will be as strong to a same-sex marriage bill now that other states have approved similar measures since civil unions became law.

"I believe we have come a long way," said Larson, who added he believes his bill will be less controversial than the debate over civil unions. His bill also explicitly deals only with civil ceremonies and does not force religious institutions to participate in marriage ceremonies they do not believe in, Larson said.

Gov. James Douglas said he continues to believe that lawmakers should put aside the idea of a same-sex marriage bill and deal instead with economic development and the state's budget.

"We have got to focus on fiscal and economic issues," Douglas said. "That should occupy every spare moment the Legislature has."

"I think we need to concentrate on those crucial issues facing Vermonters right now," agreed Rep. Heidi Scheuermann, R-Stowe. Scheuermann, who serves on the House Judiciary Committee that will likely take testimony on the marriage bill, said she hasn't decided whether to support it or not.

Legislative leaders said those fiscal issues remain their priority.

"I support gay marriage and I know it is the right thing to do," Senate President Pro Tem Peter Shumlin said. But the timing of when the bill will move and in which body has yet to be worked out, the Windham Democrat added.

Speaker of the House Shap Smith, D-Morristown, said the House will focus first on those economic and fiscal issues, particularly in key committees.

But, he added, "we do have more than three committees and I would expect us to take a look at other bills as the session moves forward," he said.

Sen. John Campbell said he is still planning on introducing a similar measure in the Senate. Although personally he would like it to move first in the Senate, the important thing is that it does move, not who gets credit for it, Campbell said.

"The specifics of the bill have yet to be decided from a process or a policy point of view," Campbell said.








READER COMMENTS


I hear the word (minority) being used quite alot now that it was brought up by Sheryl Rapee-Adams. What makes a minority? I know that it is the lesser of. I believe that gays are not really a minority. I have heard that research and the scientific community believe there could be a cure for the problems found in gays. People of color can not change what makes them a minority. I would have to say that if gays are a minority so aren't alcohloics and drug addicts. The problems are quite similar but they are not considered a minority. They will tell you that they just can not help it. I would like to know if you think in order to be fair, should we put them in the same catagory with all the other minorities. Will it help them to be noticed? Will people start to recoginize them and help them? Will it give them equality? I do not know the answer but Fair is Fair !! I don't think it will make any difference in their lives. I would like to know is anything ever equal or fair or is there always something else that we think should be done to create equality?
-- Posted by Steven DeForge on Tue, Feb 10, 2009, 11:52 pm EST

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This is, indeed, a matter of civil rights. Our Constitution is based on matters of equality. Until the Civil Rights Bill was legitimized we saw many people who were treated as "less than": People of color (black, red, yellow .. anything but white); People who were not men (that is, women) -- all of that work towards equality for ALL still has value today. My marriage, my sexuality, my "personhood" is in no way threatened or challenged by recognizing the equal status of every person regardless of anything that in part makes them "whole". I believe it's way past time that a civil marriage is recognized for everyone. Churches and religious institutions do not have to willingly perform the wedding sacrament -- this is unfortunately, perhaps, where church & state are separate. But there is NOTHING constitutional or RIGHT about denying the legal union AKA: MARRIAGE to any two persons when the only factor considered in the denial is that they may not be male/female partners. The marriage, in my opinion, needs to be recognized just as my own marriage is recognized -- no matter where I go, I know that I and my husband have legal status and protection. What possible reason could there be to deny that status & protection to any other legally united couple?? To not support "Marriage Equality" is to say some are "more equal" than others. I thought we had moved far more forward than that after all this time! How can we consider anything less than "Equal for All"??
-- Posted by Lea Hatch on Tue, Feb 10, 2009, 12:45 pm EST

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I don't think this is a civil rights issue. I know this is not a constitutional issue. Marriage vs. CU -- What's the difference? More importantly -- who freaking cares?

Deal with the economy. Ignore ALL other bills; Get the Federal money.
-- Posted by Olde Man on Mon, Feb 9, 2009, 10:29 pm EST

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My question works the other way around, Dave. If CUs are equal to civil marriage, then why do we need two separate categories? History has shown that separate is inherently unequal. Would straight couples be willing to settle for a CU instead of marriage? Why divide when we can include?

The word "marriage" is important and is universally understood. Beyond that, there is the question of portability (civil marriage is more likely to be recognized in other states), insurance (spouses getting health coverage that is denied CU partners), and federal benefits. While civil marriage equality in VT won't eliminate discrimination towards gay couples at the federal level, it will be one step closer to federal legal protections. The Vermont Commission on Family Recognition and Protection--via testimony all over the state--found a significant difference between CUs and civil marriage. Other states and courts have reached similar conclusions.

The bill introduced in the legislature is a simple way to provide fairness to gay families, who share equally in the tough economic times. It will cost nothing. I'm proud of the legislators who co-sponsored this bill not because they were forced to by a court but because it's the right thing to do.
-- Posted by Ernest McLeod on Mon, Feb 9, 2009, 6:11 pm EST

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"At issue is whether CU's are equal. If not, then civil marriage is the required solution."
Posted by Sarah Flynn on Mon, Feb 9, 2009, 9:03 am EST

It is my understanding that civil unions are equal. If not what is different and why hasn't anyone sued the state. Because the court seems satisfied that their ruling was honored. If there is to be a change it should start with a challenge of the law already on the books
-- Posted by Dave Erwin on Mon, Feb 9, 2009, 2:53 pm EST

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Patrick Cashman is mistaken in believing the VT Supreme Court ruled in favor of Civil Unions. The Court required equality for same sex couples and gave the Legislature the option to grant marriage outright or an equal alternative. At issue is whether CU's are equal. If not, then civil marriage is the required solution. This is not a matter for a Referendum, advisory or binding. The Court already decided for full equality and instructed the Legislature to provide it. Approving same sex marriage will do just that and nothing more.

Sarah Flynn
-- Posted by Sarah Flynn on Mon, Feb 9, 2009, 9:03 am EST

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As a member of the minority in question, I can say, Steven, that I do not believe I should be given preferential treatment. I believe I should be given equal treatment. Gay people share in the current economic crisis. Our families are equally affected by it. Difficult times make it all the more important that everyone has the same civil rights. The marriage bill that has been introduced is not "ramming through legislation." It has been nearly 10 years since CUs became a reality, and during that time the people of VT have come to realize that equality for gay people is nothing to be afraid of. This civil marriage bill--8 years in the making--doesn't impose on anyone's views--people will remain free to hold whatever views they want. Churches will remain free to marry or not marry any couple they wish. This bill simply gives fuller equality to gay people without costing a penny or affecting anyone else. It's one easy thing the legislature can do this session. As for the idea of a referendum--in VT we have decided, wisely, not to put civil rights issues up for popular vote. History has shown the majority is often reluctant to accept civil rights changes until after the progress has been made. Such was the case with CUs. What was controversial in 2000 is widely accepted now. Civil marriage equality will prove the same--even now polls show that more VTers are in favor of marriage equality than are against it. The legislature needn't be distracted by this bill; it's not complicated. Passing it will show that in difficult times people can come together in the name of fairness for all.
-- Posted by Ernest McLeod on Sun, Feb 8, 2009, 8:26 pm EST

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I really would like to know if being gay (minority) gives these people the idea that it allows them more leverage and they should be given preferential treatment during this crisis. I am sure it would be a good time to push something through even if it should not happen. Lawmakers should be giving their complete attention to the real problem that could consume all of us including the gay community. I would think that their priority would be what is going to happen to us and this country. There may not be anything left to worry about if this country turns into another third world country. I do not think that any of us will be getting anything if that happens. It seems pretty selfish to me!
-- Posted by Steven DeForge on Sun, Feb 8, 2009, 7:01 pm EST

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I really would like to know if being gay (minority) gives these people the idea that it allows them more leverage and they should be given preferential treatment during this crisis. I am sure it would be a good time to push something through even if it should not happen. Lawmakers should be giving their complete attention to the real problem that could consume all of us including the gay community. I would think that their priority would be what is going to happen to us and this country. There may not be anything left to worry about if this country turns into another third world country. I do not think that any of us will be getting anything if that happens. It seems pretty selfish to me!
-- Posted by Steven DeForge on Sun, Feb 8, 2009, 6:59 pm EST

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Sheryl Rapee-Adams, that may have been the best post I have read on here in a extreamly long time.

Could not have said it any better myself.
-- Posted by andrew desmarais on Sun, Feb 8, 2009, 3:07 pm EST

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People claim that only a small minority support full marriage equality, but statistically valid polling in Oct. 2008 and Jan. 2009 shows that far more people actually support full citizenship for ALL Vermont's citizens (http://www.vtfreetomarry.org/political-update.html).

Even if that were untrue, though, we do not vote on civil rights issues by referendum. Democracy (or a republic, if you like) when it's working properly protects oppressed and unpopular minorities; it's not up to the majority to deem that folks different for themselves are somehow "less than."

Voter referenda revoked minority rights in states like California and Florida because those states' constitutions are too easily changed by voter whim. My cousin, her female life partner, and their two small children live in Florida where the status and rights of their family are subject to change and dismissal, and this is terrifying; all this family wants to do is live their lives, but the ground keeps shifting under them.

By law, Vermont's constitution is better protected than that. For this, among many other things, I am grateful.
-- Posted by Sheryl Rapee-Adams on Sun, Feb 8, 2009, 10:37 am EST

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The proponents of this measure are trying to stretch the definition of "civil rights". If this is a matter of rights it should be settled in the courts, yet that question was already settled by establishing civil unions. So we have yet another manufactured emergency by a special interest group intent upon ramming through legislation to impose their views. Put the question to a referendum and let everyone's voice be heard, not just the shrill screams of a small group.
-- Posted by Patrick Cashman on Sun, Feb 8, 2009, 12:33 am EST

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Olde Man,
It is true that the legislature hands their hands full with the economic situation of the state. It is also true that at this point the marriage issue is still in committee and may not even come to the floor this first half of the biennium. I'm certain that when the legislature has given due process to the economy (as the above article suggests), that they will turn to other matters, such as civil rights, for which the country as a whole has seen a complete disregard over the last eight years.

As my previous comment also suggests, the economy (tourism) can be greatly enhanced by making marriage a civil right to all who wish to, er, engage in it.
-- Posted by Kenric Kite on Sat, Feb 7, 2009, 1:28 pm EST

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with all the problems facing Vermonters today, gay rights should not even be in the top 1,000,000,000 items to be adressed. pure unadulterated nonsense, for once the gays should put the community before their own self interest. I mean come on, you have civil unions, shut up and let the seriouse people do some seriouse work for a while...
I guess this is what they mean when they say "the circus will be back next year" i guess its just arriving early this year...
-- Posted by M. L. on Sat, Feb 7, 2009, 1:17 pm EST

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i agree
-- Posted by M. L. on Sat, Feb 7, 2009, 1:11 pm EST

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THIS is the bulls**t we pay our legislators to waste their time on ?? !!

The legislature should deal ONLY with the economic disaster. If and when they have done all they can do to deal with the economy THEN they could consider other bills.

I can't think of any matter LESS IMPORTANT than homosexual marriage right now.

.
-- Posted by Olde Man on Sat, Feb 7, 2009, 11:47 am EST

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"MAIRRIAGE: religious ceremony that formalizes the decision of a man and woman to live as husband and wife, including the accompanying social festivities"

it is already taken, come up with a new name to call it.
-- Posted by M. L. on Sat, Feb 7, 2009, 11:00 am EST

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Who the heck cares. Once the civil union bill passed all the rest is just crap. Civil Unions gave them all the leagal rights that heteros have. Just pass the law so we as a state can move on, I am so sick of this issue taking time and money away from things that matter. What a waste of time and money, enough.
-- Posted by Trudie Baker on Sat, Feb 7, 2009, 8:43 am EST

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The Vermont legislature should indeed make a quick decision on this issue. It is not worth spending a bunch of taxpayer dollars on. LET people get married, regardless, and then take more of their money. AS USUAL. Welcome to equality! DUH.
-- Posted by truth real on Fri, Feb 6, 2009, 4:49 pm EST

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This is not about religion or tradition. This is about civil rights and equality for ALL citizens. I hope that this passes because the state is the body that will recognize the unions. Not the churches (unless they wish to,) and not your own marriage (for those who think it somehow belittles their marriage.) If you do not believe in gay marriage, then don't get one.
-- Posted by Gwynn Zakov on Fri, Feb 6, 2009, 1:11 pm EST

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Well, it's about time this came to the table. Anyone who believes that a marriage of a two people of the same sex would affect the sanctity of their own, needs to see a counselor, because obviously their marriage is in trouble.

BTW, marriage increases revenue in one very important way: the service industry. Think caterers, hotels, restaurants, florists, seamstresses, tailors, rental companies...... This is a time when a lot of people are looking for work, any work. A typical (what my wife calls) "froofy" wedding costs 20-30K. That's not something to sneer about when couples are coming to Vermont to get married, gay or straight. And many do come here for the quintessential Vermont Wedding.
-- Posted by Kenric Kite on Fri, Feb 6, 2009, 9:20 am EST

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Let's hope that Governor Douglas has the courage to Veto such a bill instead of letting it become law. The majority of Vermonters as well as citizens of this country still believe in marriage as a union between 1 man and 1 woman.
-- Posted by Douglas Anthony on Fri, Feb 6, 2009, 8:09 am EST

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I do not see how marriage increases revenue but I know if pot was made legal it could possibly take care of the budget problems. With so much work to do I think it would be the right thing to do. I want all our elected officials to know, I do not think by no means that you are over worked. I do think that a bill making pot legal would be the wiser choice. I say keep working on the real problem, that is what Vermonters want.
-- Posted by Steven DeForge on Fri, Feb 6, 2009, 8:09 am EST

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It's time! While putting Vermont's economic crisis first, the legislature will be able to do very little this year that costs money. Marriage Equality is one bill that will bring hope and relief to Vermonters who still lack equal rights, it will cost the state nothing, and it will increase revenues.
-- Posted by Sheryl Rapee-Adams on Fri, Feb 6, 2009, 5:50 am EST

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